HRJ Article: Is Low-Nicotine Marlboro Snus really snus?

[rustic]

Check out http://www.harmreductionjournal.com/content/5/1/9
if you haven't seen it already. The provisional PDF is downloadable at the bottom of the page.

A really interesting article, suggesting that Philip Morris might actually be wanting Marlboro snus to suck. Snus fails in the US, and PM can then say, "Hey, we tried. Let's go sell more cigarettes".

- Jeff

[TropicalBob]

Don't you hate "conspiracy" theories? But given the U.S. tobacco industry's history, this theory seems plausible. They decide to create their own snus backwagon, then sabotage the whole thing with a low nicotine product, so smokers are turned off by the very word "snus".

Big Tobacco must be having nightmares, however, about Swedish snus' increasing popularity and the looming impact of electronic smoking devices from China.

Expect an article before long on U.S. Customs cracking down on product imports that contain either tobacco or nicotine. Tobacco powerhouses will find a way to leave addicts with cigarettes as the only option.

[chainsnuser]

The theory gives a convincing answer to the question, why Marlboro "Snus" is totally different from the real product. Indeed an interesting read.

Thanks for the link, rustic!


Cheers!

[DraculaViktor]

Interesting discussion. I smoked for several years and quit few months at time. I always ended up going back on them. I always said, "Yea I could quit anytime" I did but bottom line is, I started up again. The instant I tried snus, actually the idea of receiving my first shipment, made me stop smoking. I wanted to clear the blood of any nicotine in order to get the full effect of snus. The instant it I popped in my portion, I quit wanting to smoke. It instantly made me stop, and I haven't gone back, not even a tiny craving of cigarettes seeped back. People who are tragically addicted to smokes need to know of Snus. I know friends on the gums, lozenges and patches. All they did was make them edgy and frantic for them, as well as a more intense craving for cigarettes again. Just knowing I have snus in the fridge keeps me balanced and free from smoke. I don't snus a whole lot, but I do it everyday. Probably only 3-4 portions a day. I really like Wise 6mg. A couple portions of those gives a really nice buzz and satisfies my craving for nicotine. Plus, apparently it has the lowest TSNA, almost undetectable, than any other tobacco product. For the nicotine fix, it is the best. Oh and N&J.

[snoosiphant]

Just read the pdf and it sounds right to me. It would be so totally dumb-devious to put snus up as a decoy product to avoid litigation over cigaretts, sounds like a classic american cigarette company move.
The surprise they'll get is that other snus's (plural?) are already selling well in the US. My local store has gone through one display of triumph snus in about 2 weeks and is on its second. I don't think anybody will be really fooled except die hard marlboro brand loyalists, everybody else will just think marlboro snus sucks.

[mwood72]

I think the tobacco companies hopes of rescuing their cigarette sales are dead in the water with the public smoking bans. I can't see the governments doing a u-turn on those any day soon and so surely snus, chewing tobacco and nasal snuff is their only hope of survival. Of course as an added benefit tobacco users get a much more safer, convenient and enjoyable tobacco product in snus.

Ref the Phillip Morris conspiracy theory to manufacture low-nicotine delivery snus that sounds to me to be along the lines of the NRT conspiracy. Or maybe it's just because they are only manufacturing mini-white portions. I know they wouldn't satisfy me having used large Swedish portions.

[phish]

Interesting theory but what I really want to know is.....

Big Tobacco must be having nightmares, however, about Swedish snus' increasing popularity and the looming impact of electronic smoking devices from China.

...what the hell is an electronic smoking device :P

[TropicalBob]

Phish: Electronic smoking devices look like their cigarette, cigar or pipe counterparts but vaporize nicotine contained in cartridges. A "smoker" inhales the nicotine and gets a hit as fast as from a real cig. I've been using a pipe and cigar for about a month and a half and have moved to "high nicotine" (21mg) liquid in the cartridges. I'm a regular on www.e-cigarette.forum.com, where you can find all kinds of product reviews. Unless the FDA bans these quickly, they are destined to become a major tobacco-replacement product -- like Swedish snus! No tobacco, no smoke, so use 'em right under the "No Smoking" sign.

[phish]

The microprocessor also activates an orange LED at the tip to simulate real smoking. It not only simulates cigarette smoke but also the temperature of common cigarette's smoke (50-60 °C).

Wow, it actually looks pretty real as well (http://www.electronic-cigarettes.net/videos.html). But surely it can't be as satisfying as a good pris. It seems more like taking a drug then enjoying a natural product.

[mwood72]

This looks interesting but I'm not sure I would enjoy it as much as snus. Wouldn't people also object to you puffing nicotine smoke in their face even if that's all it contained? It's good to see another clean nicotine delivery system be developed though that could give the same nicotine hit as a cigarette as opposed to NRT's lower dose which is too low to satisfy.

[TropicalBob]

Yes, it is satisfying -- and MUCH faster than snus or any NRT product. It's as fast as a cigarette. No, it doesn't replicate smoking, though. My devices just do not produce enough vapor to keep me happy. That will come with improvements being made almost daily.

And it's not "smoke". It just looks that way. It's vapor, it's odorless and disappears in about one second. It doesn't stink up clothes or a room. It does contain some oily residue that, over time, will stick to a computer screen.

It IS a drug delivery system. That may be its downfall. There's no category in the U.S. for recreational nicotine products. And that's what these are. I enjoy them and am never without my e-cigar.

Is this better than snus? Can't say that. It's different. I've been snusing more than a year now and won't stop. Have used Stonewall since it first came on the market. Use Oliver Twist Regular daily. I don't want to quit any of the nicotine products I now use after 8 months off cigarettes.

But there are huge numbers of cigarette smokers who won't be interested in snus but will be interested in something that looks, handles and satisfies like a tobacco cigarette. E-smoking products have a big future if they're not banned as drug delivery devices.

[Smarvy]

Where do you get your Stonewall pieces Bob?

[TropicalBob]

Smarvy: Local tobacco shop carries them. They're from an American company, so you might talk your local shop into ordering a display. No refrigeration or special handling needed.

[DraculaViktor]

Hi Bob. I wanted to ask you about the e-cigs. You and I like the Wise snus and its nic power. Does the e-cig give a buzz? I was gonna order the 24mg nicotine one. Will that do the trick? Also, what site is the best to order this?
Thanks.

[TropicalBob]

I've owned an e-pipe for about two months, an e-cigar for little more than a month and a half. I have two e-cigs arriving this coming week. I started with "medium" nicotine ( 11mg strength in the liquid form). That wasn't enough to do much of anything and it didn't taste at all like tobacco. My most recent order was the "extra high" nicotine (24mg) and it will give you a nic hit. Not with one puff, but in about the same time as it takes to smoke a cigarette.

Let me add that I'm often snusing while using the cigar as a hand prop. It's a great conversation starter and I punctuate my animated talk with it like George Burns did with his cigar. As for flavor, I've settled on flue-cured tobacco. I like that better than "light" tobacco or "regular" tobacco.

I order e-Liquid from e-cig.com; you can buy the devices from many sources now on the Internet. I'm happy with my e-smoking stuff but not at all ready to give up snus. There's room for both in my world.