"Danger follows a camel on a small tin box"

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  • darkwing
    Member
    • Oct 2007
    • 415

    #1

    "Danger follows a camel on a small tin box"

    Minneapolis Star Tribune:

    Danger follows a camel on a small tin box
    Featured comment

    As expected, the St. Paul City Council on Wednesday approved an ordinance banning the sale of candy cigarettes, a victory due largely to a feisty group of teen activists working with the Association for Nonsmokers-Minnesota.

    There's no doubt that candy cigarettes were my gateway drug to an adult addiction to Tootsie rolls and expensive Swiss chocolate. To be fair, though, these teens deserve our genuine props for tireless research, wonderful intentions and an admirable willingness to fight the law and win.

    Now I'd like to draw their fire away from a product that most retailers don't even carry anymore, to something I hope is their next target: R.J. Reynolds' colorful new line of real danger.

    Within the next few months, the tobacco giant will launch three smokeless -- and spit-less -- products in the Twin Cities under the Camel label. This follows its recent introduction of Snus (rhymes with goose and should be banned solely for its name), a neat little tin filled with dissolvable tobacco packets to be placed under the tongue. The launch of Camel Orbs (tiny mints in "fresh" and "mellow" flavors), Sticks (shaped like toothpicks) and Strips (that melt on the tongue) comes as cigarette smoking continues to decline among the young.

    Let's get the obvious out of the way: Of course, these products carry a warning that they are not a safe alternative to cigarettes. Of course, their sale to minors is prohibited. Of course, those are the reasons they'll be extremely appealing to some kids.

    Smokeless products "are definitely where the tobacco industry is going," said Aaron Doeppers, Midwest region director for the Campaign for Tobacco-Free Kids. The big reason? Smoke-free laws moving across the country. Doeppers, of Madison, Wis., said RJR's marketing machine touts these products as something you can take "into a fancy tapas bar or rock concert."

    Or U.S. history class, where you can pop a few Orbs tablets before that mid-term. While smokeless tobacco use among Americans is small compared with cigarettes, it is highest among young people. About 3 percent of adults use smokeless tobacco products (compared with about 21 percent who smoke), according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Nationwide, among ages 14 to 18, about 22 percent smoke cigarettes, (an impressive drop from 36 percent a decade ago), but smokeless use is at about 8 percent and growing.

    The numbers don't surprise Marc Manley, a medical director at Blue Cross Blue Shield of Minnesota, which is using a chunk of its Big Tobacco lawsuit award to research tobacco addiction. "From 80 to 90 percent of smokers start before their 18th birthday," Manley said, "so it's kind of hard to disguise these as adult products. Most adults just aren't going to start using tobacco."

    Why do kids start? The usual suspects: Parents who smoke, peers who smoke, sexy marketing. Those who chew instead say it's because they don't want to blow smoke at their friends. Or because they figure they won't get caught. Most, though, think it's safer than cigarettes.

    In fact, smokeless tobacco contains 28 cancer-causing agents, fewer than the 60 or so carcinogens in cigarettes, but not exactly healthful.

    With new smokeless options come new concerns. Doeppers said girls, who are barely on the radar of smokeless use, may now take a look since they don't have to spit. Poison-control workers worry that young users "might pop five or six Camel Orbs, which look like a Tic Tac, into their mouth at once. All these things are toxic in the long run," he said.

    In the short run, too. Within five years, smokeless tobacco users already are at a heightened risk for oral cancer. Want to see pictures of what that looks like? Search the Web as I did, but not before lunch.

    While the jury is still out on whether smokeless tobacco is, indeed, a precursor to smoking, Doeppers said that debate is nearly moot. Young users, he said, are moving away from choosing one nicotine fix over the other. They're choosing both, wooed by slick marketing for all products within the tobacco family.

    Before they know it, they are stuck and sorry.

    Corey Bye, 19, of Cokato, Minn., started smoking less than a year ago, influenced by buddies who smoked. The hockey and baseball player regretted it immediately.

    "I get tired really fast after I play," said Bye, a freshman at St. Cloud Technical College.

    Does he want to quit? Absolutely. Has he tried? Several times.

    "It's pretty hard, actually," Bye said. "I thought it would be easy, but I just get cravings sometimes. I don't want to get lung cancer. It's the dumbest thing to do."

    Gail Rosenblum • 612-673-7350 • gail.rosenblum@startribune.com


    Comment on this story | Read all 30 comments
  • lakari
    Member
    • Apr 2009
    • 19

    #2
    most interesting,but well we choose to use it,so we agree with the consequences

    Comment

    • deebocools
      Member
      • Nov 2008
      • 661

      #3
      A) he says snus should be banned "solely for it's name". Hilarious! If you think being a bigoted xenophobic blowhard is funny

      B)snus doesn't disolve under the tongue, unless you're some kind of rattlesnake or big vat of acid(with a tongue)

      C) activist groups of "non-smokers"? When I didn't use tobacco, my favorite thing to do was... something else. It amazes me someone who's got it together enough to not use tobacco still wastes their free-time on fighting it.

      beyond personal freedom and personal choice... what happened to minding your own damn business? If you have a personal vendetta against tobacco, don't use it. You can even not associate with anyone who uses it if you want, it's called freedom of association. anything beyond that is bullying

      Comment

      • reshumate
        Member
        • May 2008
        • 94

        #4
        The US and its puritan roots rears its head again. How are these things marketed to kids? You still have to be 18. If it keeps people from smoking, then it's a good thing. Something too many on the religious right can't seem to look past.

        Comment

        • joshua
          Member
          • Dec 2008
          • 214

          #5
          They can start lobbying to change laws when they're old enough to vote. Stupid know it all bastard teenagers. Once you can buy porn and have a beer you can start telling people what to do with their lives, ya buncha ****s.

          Comment

          • ShaulWolf
            Member
            • Jan 2009
            • 495

            #6
            Did I catch a hint of "Ban it for the children" in there?

            Did I also catch that it's not as bad as cigarettes, even if it's not as healthy as not using tobacco to begin with?

            And really, how is this marketed towards kids? Because it's got flashy colors and logos on it? Hell, if that's the case then there's a lot of adult stuff marketed towards kids. You can even say sex toys packaged in bright flashy colors with sexy pictures on it is marketed towards kids then.

            Too much misinformation among these jackasses who think they're doing good by limiting choice for everyone else. I like my freedom to choose what habits I get into or not.

            Comment

            • SSgtTrav
              Member
              • Feb 2009
              • 136

              #7
              I'm with you guys on this shit. Let me do what ever in the hell I want to myself. I could care less if someone says its bad. Its my body asshole leave me alone. As far as doing it for the kids, I have a better suggestion. How about you start ****ing parenting your kids instead of blaming shit on everything else. It's not big tobacco, the video game industry, or tv thats ****ing up your kids. It's your shitty parenting and not taking responsibility for them thats ****ing them up. You don't want your kid to smoke then stop them from smoking and leave the rest of us alone.

              Comment

              • Xobeloot
                Member
                • Jan 2008
                • 2542

                #8
                Screw putting my snus under my tongue. That is for pussies. I use it rectally. The icetool makes for perfect insertion... and the buzz... WHOA! :lol:

                I hate people who write about things and can't even correctly describe how it is used :evil:

                Comment

                • Royksprekk

                  #9
                  I agree with pretty much everything that has been said here, except...

                  ...reread the paragraph about the "dissolvable" nicotine products. They're not talking about snus; they're talking about something even dumber...it was just badly written by my hometown newspaper...

                  Not surprising, seeing as how RJ Reynold's version of snus is as close to candy as snus gets...though like many here, it what "opened the gates" for me...

                  By the way, I've been a long time lurker on this forum...so, hey all!

                  Comment

                  • Quemador
                    Member
                    • Apr 2009
                    • 83

                    #10
                    "This follows its recent introduction of Snus (rhymes with goose and should be banned solely for its name), a neat little tin filled with dissolvable tobacco packets to be placed under the tongue."


                    Outstanding.

                    Comment

                    • Royksprekk

                      #11
                      Yeah, I worded that really badly, maybe the writing style of the article is contagious.

                      My point was I'm guessing she meant to be talking about the upcoming Camel products which sound like candy (or breath mints at best) to me. I used to write for my college's newspaper, and the damn editors (who didn't always understand the subject matter) would rearrange my sentences all the time, destroying all original meaning. I'm guessing that's what might have happened here (I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt, though she might not deserve it), although the story is still ridiculous.



                      Aside from that, I'm just kind of annoyed at Camel's marketing of their "alternative tobacco products," even though it makes sense as their true niche lies in their cigarettes. They don't really mention much about harm reduction (personal and public), and tend to pitch their version of snus as something to avoid niccing out at a bar or an airplane...instead of a better form of tobacco consumption in virtually almost every imaginable category. And although I first became aware of swedish snus when Camel snus came out, all of their flavors remind me of rehashed versions of flavored versions of their cigarettes in years past...stale tobacco with a spoonful of sugar on top...

                      Then again, some friends of mine who didn't mind the Camel snus (except for it's unsatisfactory nicotine levels) couldn't even get past the smell of my first can of General (or if they did, the salt killed them.)

                      Sadly, I don't think many smokers would give real snus a decent try if it were widely available in the US, even with all the non-smoking laws coming out...the only good thing about Camel snus is in its potential to bridge the gap...

                      Comment

                      • deebocools
                        Member
                        • Nov 2008
                        • 661

                        #12
                        I'm well sick of the "americans won't do it" arguments. This board is populated primarily with north americans who use and like swedish snus. There are countless others who use it and don't talk about it on message boards, and how many times have you seen the snubies saying "this is alot better than that camel stuff"?

                        It's not like every american is injecting sugar straight into their bloodstream(even if the market treats us as such). snus doesn't need to build a bridge to amercians, they just need to put it in the convenience stores. I have alot of respect for general for not altering their product for "american tastes" because they realize americans are the same species as swedes.

                        It's easy to think that everyone here is clever and has sophisticated tastes, but the truth is people like swedish snus because it's easy to like, in any country

                        Comment

                        • Soft Morning, City!
                          Member
                          • Sep 2007
                          • 772

                          #13
                          Originally posted by deebocools

                          It's easy to think that everyone here is clever and has sophisticated tastes, but the truth is people like swedish snus because it's easy to like, in any country
                          I agree. I have yet have one of my friends who use American dip or chew react badly to snus.

                          I think the main difficulty is getting people to consider using smokeless in the first place. A lot of smokers I know think that dipping or chewing is disgusting and simply refuse to try snus at all because they don't see the difference. You're still putting tobacco in your mouth, rather than inhaling smoke and that seems weird and gross to them.

                          Comment

                          • chainsnuser
                            Senior Member
                            • Jan 2007
                            • 1389

                            #14
                            Originally posted by deebocools
                            It's easy to think that everyone here is clever and has sophisticated tastes, but the truth is people like swedish snus because it's easy to like, in any country
                            Yes, I also can't stand the snobbishness of some gourmets to think they have better tastes than other people as well as the ignorance of some fast-food eaters, who think that haute cuisine or slow food is only for (rich) weirdos with strange taste.

                            But this kind of thinking is very common. Even a valued member of this forum says on another forum that the more traditional brands of snus are only for people with "severely damaged tastebuds" and everbody should try flavored dry portions first. What a nonsense! I maybe would still be smoking if I only had tried some low-nicotine, artificially flavored, sickly sweet new brands. I can only use them as an alternation but not as my mainstay.

                            Cheers!

                            Comment

                            • deebocools
                              Member
                              • Nov 2008
                              • 661

                              #15
                              It's very weird that someone can use the traditional type of snus every day, then turn around and say that other people(be they amercians, women, etc.) just wouldn't like the same thing.

                              Comment

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