USPS Bankrupt Bailout or cuts or both

[Bigblue1]

“Our situation is extremely serious,” the postmaster general, Patrick R. Donahoe, said in an interview. “If Congress doesn’t act, we will default.

Thanks again PACT act! http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/05/bu...pagewanted=all

[GoVegan]

UPS is slow and expensive. You also have to hope someone is around when your package of snus is being delivered to sign for it. I would be more than happy to pay the post office $5 extra to check my ID when picking up a package of snus. The convenience of being able to pick up packages at the post office along with lower shipping costs compared to UPS would have made it a win win situation.

[shikitohno]

Personally, I think there's no saving it. Lots of people have come to associate it with bad service, long shipping times, randomly losing mail on you, and breaking stuff in transit. You can try bailing them out as much as you want, but for the reasons I've just mentioned, many people just avoid them all together and don't use it any more.

UPS is slow and expensive. You also have to hope someone is around when your package of snus is being delivered to sign for it. I would be more than happy to pay the post office $5 extra to check my ID when picking up a package of snus. The convenience of being able to pick up packages at the post office along with lower shipping costs compared to UPS would have made it a win win situation.

UPS has never just decided I wouldn't be home, and left the package in the warehouse, then not even bothered to leave a notice until the day before it's about to be sent back on me. USPS pulls that on me all the time. It's why I have to get tracking every time I use it, because if I don't know something's down there, they'll decide to skip leaving notices until the last day possible. It's quite frustrating if you pay to have something sent to you, then on a Saturday, you get your first notice that they've been trying to deliver it, and you need to pick it up at the post office that day or it's going back. Conveniently, any day of the week they do this, my mail doesn't get here until after the post office itself is closed. Which leaves me waiting twice as long, and having to pay extra to have it shipped again.

Post office closes at 5PM here on weekdays, noon on Saturdays. Mon-Fri the mail man shows up any time between 4:45-6PM. Saturdays he's usually around 3PM. Yes, I realise I could pay to have the delivery by 10AM option or whatever it is, but if your business model requires customers shell out for your premium service if they want to actually be able to use it, you need a new one. Also, hours suck. Seriously, banks are open here for several hours longer, and they don't close for 90 minutes so everyone can take lunch at the same time.

[RobsanX]

I love UPS. I've never had the problems that others here have experienced with them.

I'm not sure what will happen with the USPS. Direct mail is one of the most effective campaign tools, so I don't see congress scrapping it, ever.

[CoderGuy]

I do everything with ebills and estatements. The only mail I get anymore is trash. I do use them for shipping though as it's usually faster and cheaper than UPS or FedEx. Not sure how I feel about another bailout, especially as there is little chance of recovering the money.

[truthwolf1]

Just another AMTRAK

[Snusdog]

Of course..............congress could always let them ship products that are still legal ....................that might help

and holy crap shiki..............you must live right next door to me..................I get my mail at exactly the same times.

[sirloot]

idk the problem could be with the union? overpaid retirement and heathcare ? what other company pays for your healthcare after you no longer work there ? just because you work for the govt you shouldnt get benefits above and beyond the public sector seeing as its probably paid for by tax $.. maybe they need to scale that back .. i mean they get social security at 65 like everyone else right ? "Postal workers also receive more generous health benefits than most other federal employees." I can see having better benefits for retired/military .. but ive never seen my postman have to dodge bullets or be on the lookout for insurgents with ied's

heres a good solution .. close the doors on USPS let them get a job with UPS or Fedex as im sure they will need more employees with an influx of biz .. quit propping up failing industrys. it will work itself out.

[Darwin]

A restructuring of the PS sufficient to turn things around without massive cash infusions is just not possible. Many of the problems, but not all certainly, are due to the requirements of the postal workers union and getting that body to agree to the wide-ranging procedural changes (and probable union hobbling measures) needed seems a pipe dream. As recent events have shown this administration's attitude toward unions is very far indeed from confrontational. Bailout a-comin'.

[sgreger1]

In all honesty, I think the USPS is obsolete.

Think about it, in a time where you can digitally email or fax someone correspondence at light speed for nothing but the a small amount of electricity, is it really still practical to cut down a tree to make the paper, another tree for the envelope, then have a truck come pick up said envelope from your house, drive it across the country or across the world (Sometimes utilizing airplanes etc) and then deliver it to someone elses house? And all for like 40 cents?


I think we should have more mailbox etc type stores (USPS stores sort of) and charge $1 per letter. 80% of mail is just junk mailers anyways. Shut down USPS, keep a mail sytem open that is greatly reduced in size and that costs $1 instead of 40 cents, and give in to the fact that the pony express is just no longer a sustainable way of delivering correspondence.

[CoderGuy]

In all honesty, I think the USPS is obsolete.

Think about it, in a time where you can digitally email or fax someone correspondence at light speed for nothing but the a small amount of electricity, is it really still practical to cut down a tree to make the paper, another tree for the envelope, then have a truck come pick up said envelope from your house, drive it across the country or across the world (Sometimes utilizing airplanes etc) and then deliver it to someone elses house? And all for like 40 cents?


I think we should have more mailbox etc type stores (USPS stores sort of) and charge $1 per letter. 80% of mail is just junk mailers anyways. Shut down USPS, keep a mail sytem open that is greatly reduced in size and that costs $1 instead of 40 cents, and give in to the fact that the pony express is just no longer a sustainable way of delivering correspondence.

Yep, privatization is the way to go. Turn USPS into franchises and put them where you need them, get the gov't out of the picture and it will be cheaper and more efficient.

[Darwin]

Since I have current experience in the direct mail field I'll chime in here with a few observations. The company for which I work, not especially gainfully I might add, is in the direct mail business but not really the "junk mail" business. All of the mailings overseen by this company use lists of names and addresses of persons who in some way have previously contacted the organization for which the mailing is being done. Mostly this consists of outfits who solicit sundry reactions or contributions from those in their membership databases. Almost entirely these outfits are charities or political organizations who are accessing their own memberships or referrals from members. Very few, if any, of this solicitation is "over the transom". Everyone receiving these mailings is not surprised at communication from said organization, they are usually already members. Annoyed perhaps but not surprised. The mailings may in some sense be "unsolicited" but if one has contributed to XYZ charity or political organization then further communication from them should hardly be surprising.

I have never seen pass through my company mailings which most would consider real "junk mail"--that is blanketed un-targeted mailings scattershot across some geographic area. Not that this doesn't happen but it seems that this approach is in serious decline for many of the same reasons described by others in this thread. The internet will continue to hasten this decline but I have a feeling that the type of direct mail my company does will at least maintain itself at current levels and may actually increase. Already people are becoming almost immune to e-mail solicitations so "personalized" mail delivered to one's door may retain a certain cachet of importance for some time to come. And I'm hardly worried that all this activity endangers any trees. 100 percent of all the paper used in the printing industry nowadays is sourced from the recycling stream or is made from the pulp of farm raised trees. Visions of magnificent old growth monarchs of the forest being felled to make envelopes or sale flyers are just delusional malarkey.

If the USPS did not have this steady stream of business it would have folded a long time ago and we wouldn't be having these arguments now. The demand shows little sign of slowing so if the real USPS disappears some other similar organization will take its place without doubt. Maybe it will be divested of the deadening financial accretions and federal mandates under which the current service struggles. Let's hope.

[sgreger1]

Since I have current experience in the direct mail field I'll chime in here with a few observations. The company for which I work, not especially gainfully I might add, is in the direct mail business but not really the "junk mail" business. All of the mailings overseen by this company use lists of names and addresses of persons who in some way have previously contacted the organization for which the mailing is being done. Mostly this consists of outfits who solicit sundry reactions or contributions from those in their membership databases. Almost entirely these outfits are charities or political organizations who are accessing their own memberships or referrals from members. Very few, if any, of this solicitation is "over the transom". Everyone receiving these mailings is not surprised at communication from said organization, they are usually already members. Annoyed perhaps but not surprised. The mailings may in some sense be "unsolicited" but if one has contributed to XYZ charity or political organization then further communication from them should hardly be surprising.

I have never seen pass through my company mailings which most would consider real "junk mail"--that is blanketed un-targeted mailings scattershot across some geographic area. Not that this doesn't happen but it seems that this approach is in serious decline for many of the same reasons described by others in this thread. The internet will continue to hasten this decline but I have a feeling that the type of direct mail my company does will at least maintain itself at current levels and may actually increase. Already people are becoming almost immune to e-mail solicitations so "personalized" mail delivered to one's door may retain a certain cachet of importance for some time to come. And I'm hardly worried that all this activity endangers any trees. 100 percent of all the paper used in the printing industry nowadays is sourced from the recycling stream or is made from the pulp of farm raised trees. Visions of magnificent old growth monarchs of the forest being felled to make envelopes or sale flyers are just delusional malarkey.

If the USPS did not have this steady stream of business it would have folded a long time ago and we wouldn't be having these arguments now. The demand shows little sign of slowing so if the real USPS disappears some other similar organization will take its place without doubt. Maybe it will be divested of the deadening financial accretions and federal mandates under which the current service struggles. Let's hope.

Lol, I dind't actually mean to imply that I care what is being cut down to mail letters. I was just oulying how innefficient mail is relative to other forms of correspondence. The issue here is that the USPS is not like other gov orgs, it is required to maintain a balanced budget and pay for what it spends. Right now they don't have enough money. If we get into the habit of bailing things out it will only lead us further down the rabbit hole.

Imagine if the pony express had been bailed out after they went obsolete, or imagine if the horse industry had been subsidized to help it continue to function once cars were invented? I think this is something the market should decide. Innovation will take over, and advertisers will just find a new and more creative way to spam people.

If they want to continue operating, they need to raise rates subtantially. If people still buy it and USPS can remain solvent, than good for them, if they see a decrease in demand and can't keep the bills paid, than it means it's time to go and rethink the business model.

Junk mail in the United States accounts for one-third of all the mail delivered in the world. So by raising rates we may be able to reduce the amount of junkmail substantially, and also keep our landfills and oceans free of said junkmail which is where most of it inevitably ends up. I know junkmail/mailers is probably where the USPS makes most of it's money, but this is the whole point is that it needs to rethink it's business model.


Either way, realisticly I don't see any way the USPS is going to be allowed to fail this round. They will get bailed out and then raise rates a little and this will all be non news in another month or two.

[Darwin]

I'm pretty sure that direct mail companies would use a service that only catered to their needs of their clients if the prices weren't too prohibitive but changes in federal law would be required that would have zero chance of being implemented. Regarding efficiency charity and political organizations are still convinced that a piece of physical mail is more effective than any electronic communication in achieving results. I doubt they'd still be spending the money on snail mail if e-mail was equally or more effective. About the only way the USPS could rethink its business model is to simply quit handling ordinary personal mail which would really cause the henhouse to erupt in fierce squawking. Don't see that happening. The organizational, regulatory, and labor relations issues are just too immense to be overcome. Only choice is to hit the silk--bailout.

[shikitohno]

I'd feel bad for the one kid that drives the truck most days if USPS had to close. If they screw up and I need to walk down to the post office to pick something up because they never put it in the truck, he'll give me a ride back home. But the rest of the employees there are big enough dicks to more than nullify that. The old hippy guy down the block has big block parties every so often, and walks around his neighbourhood and sticks and invite in everyone's mailbox. The one carrier will go around and take every single one out of the mailboxes, mark them 'return to sender - insufficient postage.' and stuff them all back in his mailbox. I had to go down to the post office to pick up a package before I went in for work in the afternoon. It was one of many instances where they didn't but a single notice in my box until the one telling me it was about to be sent back. I needed to get my package, so I called up the post office to have them hold it, and asked the Post Master if he would be there. On the phone he tells me he'll keep the desk open an extra 10 minutes before he goes on lunch, so I can grab it and get to work on time. In person, he smiles at me as he closes the shutter 5 minutes early. Personally, I don't get the love some people have for USPS. I hope they close, and a better private service steps in.

I can think of one way to balance the budget for USPS, and probably even give it a surplus. Legalize crack, coke and heroin, but only allow them to be purchased at the post office, with a 20% tax being set on them, on top of sales tax. Junkies and crack heads would have them swimming in money.