Made in China?

[ABW]

It will not last for china... As they develop a middle class they will not be able to produce products for the prices that they do now... Production cost will rise and so will all the cost associated with an educated middle-class workforce.. Then what? They better have some real quality "Chinese" products or they are going to be in big trouble.. By then they should have had enough time to pollute the entire planet.. They have absolutely no shame when it comes to sending it "downstream".. Disgusting...

All things being close to the same you will see people choose to buy thier products from home...

[lxskllr]

How's this for a cool bit of irony?

While that amuses me, it strikes me as being ridiculous wasting fuel, shipping containers of chopsticks to the other side of the world. Why do they need chopsticks at all? Have a nice set for the house, and carry a pair around with you. They easily fit in a pocket, and are easy to clean. Hell, a couple minutes with my pocket knife, I could make a set of sticks. C'mon now. They're f'n sticks. Not exactly the pinnacle of human design :^D

[Ephemeris]

I briefly entertained the thought of using China to print The Ephemeris. Even with freight costs, it would be significantly cheaper to have it printed and bound overseas and shipped back here than I'm paying now. And truth be told, the final product looks pretty good- even better than what it looks like from my local printer.

But at the end of the day, my conscience got the best of me. The paper and ink that the Chinese use is horrendous and probably toxic. (The trade term for Chinese ink is Ch-ink and it's as derogatory a term as it sounds). After a while the pages brittle and fall out. The ink never really dries, it just gets less stable over time and smudges off. The glue on the binding dries up and the cover comes loose. In short, while the final product is nice and shiny and looks great, it's inferior in every way to what I can get done in America.

Unfortunately, the average American printer doesn't even want to walk away from his desk unless he thinks he's going to make 10 grand for a half hour's worth of work. Then when you start talking about acid-free this and archival-grade that he wants to charge you 150% over wholesale for paper that has been sitting in his storeroom for a decade.

So I see it from both sides. I think Americans should buy American every opportunity they can, but at the same time I understand why someone looks at the final price and decides to buy Chinese. But I also boycott China for humanitarian reasons. I find it sickening that our leaders feel that it's OK to owe China 5 billion dollars but we're not allowed to smoke Cuban cigars. The hypocrisy is astounding.

[lxskllr]

I briefly entertained the thought of using China to print The Ephemeris. Even with freight costs, it would be significantly cheaper to have it printed and bound overseas and shipped back here than I'm paying now. And truth be told, the final product looks pretty good- even better than what it looks like from my local printer.

FWIW, I appreciate you choosing American printing. While I prefer an electronic copy, Chinese printing could be the tipping point of whether I bought the magazine or not. My funds are limited, and if I saw Ephemeris in the store, and noticed it was printed in China, it would make me less inclined to buy it. Like all purchasing decisions, a lot goes into them, at least for me. "Made in China" isn't an immediate deal breaker, but it's solidly in the negative category, and depending on how everything else measured up, it could keep my money in my pocket.

[Jwalker]

"So I see it from both sides. I think Americans should buy American every opportunity they can, but at the same time I understand why someone looks at the final price and decides to buy Chinese. But I also boycott China for humanitarian reasons. I find it sickening that our leaders feel that it's OK to owe China 5 billion dollars but we're not allowed to smoke Cuban cigars. The hypocrisy is astounding."

Do you mean 5 trillion?

Also on the story 2 million chopsticks is practically nothing I'd think china goes through a little under 1.3 billion pairs a day that's probably about right, not every meal uses them probably but I can see some people going through 2-3 pairs a day. Plus other countries Japan, Korea, and the U.S. go through a lot too probably. They also probably smoke a few billion cigarettes a day. That's honestly most of the reason for their environmental problems is anything times 1.3 billion is a lot. I wonder how much stuff like tea and rice they go through every day.

[texastorm]

My company sells a product we have tried very hard to produce here in the US. The trouble is simple, if we buy it from china its crap and we could price it at 20 bucks. If we buy it from Taiwan (and we do) its decent and we have to price it at 80 dollars. I am not advertising for my company here but this is a common garden tool, we have to compete with Home Depot and Lowes and such and they buy this type of item only from china.

When we tried very hard to source this in the USA, even assembling the final product ourselves we would have to price it at 300 dollars. Given the fact you can buy something similar for 30 bucks at any box store we are stuck with our present supply.

People come up to me all the time talking about their grandparents tools and how good they still are after all these years, and yet when it comes time to buy, we all end up opting for the cheaper short term solution. We have become a nation of disposable products. Nothing we buy lasts, we all want our items to last longer, but we are seemingly not willing to pay the price.

Remember when Craftsman tools were made in the USA? Yeah those were the days.

[Mawdryn]

I make a conscious effort to buy US products every day; with the internet, you can find all sorts of domestic options.

Step 1: Stop going to WalMart. Don't set foot in there. Ever. I haven't set foot in a WalMart in well over 5 years.

BTW, isn't the tobacco for most snus grown in China?

[desirexe]

I'm not from outside the US, can I still comment?? I love to flyfish and noticed a lot of my tying gear and accessories do not have "made in china" label on them but rather, "made in pakistan." My tying tools and stuff may have been made in pak but at least I can say my flies were made in the U.S, by me! Anyway...carry on, I too am interested in lxs's original question...

[GoVegan]

One thing I've been started to use is CAT socks. They lasts about over 10 times longer than some crappy cheap socks. I guess they're not made in China.

Caterpillar makes socks? Are the bright yellow with orange stripes?

[lxskllr]

Caterpillar makes socks? Are the bright yellow with orange stripes?

:^P

[Mykislt]

Yes.

except for clothing and food

[Ephemeris]

BTW, isn't the tobacco for most snus grown in China?

I don't know about the other companies, but not Swedish Match.

[Roo]

I'm not from outside the US, can I still comment?? I love to flyfish and noticed a lot of my tying gear and accessories do not have "made in china" label on them but rather, "made in pakistan." My tying tools and stuff may have been made in pak but at least I can say my flies were made in the U.S, by me! Anyway...carry on, I too am interested in lxs's original question...

Pakistan is among the quickest of countries to employ child labor, so things that need delicate small hands for assembly (tying knots) like fly-fishing ties or sporting equipment like soccer balls are often made there.

[Snusdog]

Why would a nation knowingly sacrifice its productivity, the livelihood of its citizens, and knowingly support human rights violations..............

The answer is that corporations and knobbiest are writing the laws.

If you had to pay $30 more for a wrench...............but you made $30 more for the hammers your company made the cost factor would be relative.

However, when companies that employ children or exploit their workers are allowed to trade in the open market....................they sell their hammers for 10..........you loose money and so buy your wrenches for $10..........Soon both you and Mr Wrench are out of business and working in a service industry....................

Back in the day corporate greed ran things......................but it was American companies selling to American people (there was a check and balance) and in the end these companies by necessity had the interest of American in mind

Today.................non American or Global companies that do not have the interest of the country in mind are nonetheless making the laws that run this country

And thus the problem we face today

[lxskllr]

Why would a nation knowingly sacrifice its productivity, the livelihood of its citizens, and knowingly support human rights violations..............

The answer is that corporations and knobbiest are writing the laws.

If you had to pay $30 more for a wrench...............but you made $30 more for the hammers your company made the cost factor would be relative.

However, when companies that employ children or exploit their workers are allowed to trade in the open market....................they sell their hammers for 10..........you loose money and so buy your wrenches for $10..........Soon both you and Mr Wrench are out of business and working in a service industry....................

Back in the day corporate greed ran things......................but it was American companies selling to American people (there was a check and balance) and in the end these companies by necessity had the interest of American in mind

Today.................non American or Global companies that do not have the interest of the country in mind are nonetheless making the laws that run this country

And thus the problem we face today

Pretty good analysis Dog. I don't know if it's nostalgia for a time that never existed, but it seems like companies used to take pride in their name, and the products they made. They competed on making the best product, and not the most money for shareholders. Now companies whore out their name for Chinese junk that doesn't even have anything to do with their core business(Ruger pocket knives, CAT boots...), and quarterly profits are the primary goal. GM would sell you a bag of shit if they could increase their stock price. To hell with the name, and excelling. It's all about the money :^S