Does anyone here know PYTHON (the programming language) or any others?

[captncaveman]

Truthwolf- i can see flash conversions to HTML5 happening a lot more due to the fact that some mobile devices can't run flash, also flash is still rather slow. It will never replace flash in my opinion just because there is way too many flash devs out there. But for the mobile market it just makes sense. Now remember the whole web 2.0 hype of AJAX, that was going to be the flash killer.... or M$ silverlight (HAHAHAHA..). From what i have seen from some talented HTML5 and HTML/CSS devs there has been some nice apps and awesome GUI's built so far. But HTML5 will be just another tool in the huge tool chest of web development, a welcomed one at that.

Tim- i played with Ruby a bit, but never really did much with it. If i also had some motivation perhaps i could get more involved. But i am happy right now on just brushing the surface. Basically checking if the grass is greener.... nope same shape.

[sgreger1]

Copy paste is your issue. The formatting form the copy paste IDLE and Terminal hates it, specifically the quotes. Ether copy paste into say a text editor save as .py. Open it up in IDLE. You will notice the words in the quotes will NOT be "green" thats that defualt color in unix/linux and windows i assume it will be the same in Mac. All you have to do is just erase the quotes and replace them. The save and either hit F5 or Run -> Run module.

You don't have to use IDLE i use eclipse as my main dev environment. http://www.eclipse.org/

If its freezing up or crashing i would either not use IDLE or reinstall it. Personally i would also to python 3 i prefer the syntax alot more but thats just me.

I did copy and paste it into a text file which I then saved as .py, but when it loads it it just crashes before I can even run the script. I can't get it to work in the terminal either.

I will try Eclipse and hopefully that will work better.

Do you recommend any books on the subject that you found to be helpfull, especially ot a beginner?


Also, I hear python2.6/2.7 was the way to go because more stuff was written in it or compatable with it or something, is this true? AS a newbie, should I be learning on 3 or 2.7?

[sgreger1]

I was a programmer for many years and programmed in so many languages, I probably couldn't list them all. But, I've been retired for a year and a half, now, and there isn't much need to program at home. I want to become proficient in Ruby (I know the basics), but I just can't get inspired.

My favorite language of all time (that I used) is Smalltalk.

Tim

Has anyone here ever heard of Ruby Rails? Is this something anyone here has tried?

[sgreger1]

Getting flashbacks of early html classe's. I hate code and think it is backwords to work that way as interactive designer but understand exactly why it is there. Visual authoring software has always made things much easier.

Anybody have any idea about this whole HTML 5 switchover that is supposedly going to takeover 2013?

I have already seen in the industry many who are switching out much of their flash already and I dont think it was because of early
iphones.

Actually it is almost entirely because of the iphone. The industry has been slow to dump flash for more up to date technology like HTML 5 but with the insane volume of smart phone they are selling that don't support Flash, they are being forced to switch if they want to play ball with everybody else. This is even considering that flash still makes up the majority of stuff on the itnernet as far as videos and most of the interactive things like games, so it won't be going anywhere fo ra while but HTML5 is already a huge presence in the market.

All of youtube is already in HTML5, as is a huge chunk of the internet including pr0n and lots of others are jumping on board too. THere's ltos of money to be made i the mobile market and people want to capitalize. Apple controlls enough market-share to be able to influence things like that.

[captncaveman]

As a newbie i would go with 3.0 2.6 is basically dead (not supported any more) 2.7 will be supported for a long time yet. There is alot of 3.0 stuff around the block and fro free. http://learnpythonthehardway.org/index is awesome he has a book addressing 2.7 and 3.0 and its fee he also has a link to a byte of python website. Again its a free book/tutorial covering 2.7 or 3.0. Both site have many followers that can help you if you are stuck also the authors will even help you out.

Once basic knowledge is obtained of the language you won't be needing any or many books/tutorials helpto you out on your way (addressing just python alone, then you can start dabbling into database's, web frameworks SDK's CDK's ect)

I'm not a mac user so i can't help on that side of things.

[kreigle]

I did copy and paste it into a text file which I then saved as .py, but when it loads it it just crashes before I can even run the script. I can't get it to work in the terminal either.

I will try Eclipse and hopefully that will work better.

Do you recommend any books on the subject that you found to be helpfull, especially ot a beginner?


Also, I hear python2.6/2.7 was the way to go because more stuff was written in it or compatable with it or something, is this true? AS a newbie, should I be learning on 3 or 2.7?

captncaveman touched on it earlier. I believe it has to do with the quotes in the text you copied. The quotes that show in the code you pasted are slanted, e.g.:

# Area calculation program

print “Welcome to the Area calculation program”
print “–––––––––––––”

when they should be plain quotes

# Area calculation program

print "Welcome to the Area calculation program"
print "–––––––––––––"

[captncaveman]

Did you install the 64 bit version of IDLE? there seems to be issues with Mac OSX 10.6

Take a look

http://www.python.org/download/mac/tcltk/

[captncaveman]

ARG after many of quick searches on Mac python forums there seems to be many issues.... I would hope this doesn't leave you with a bad taste in your mouth for programming. Trust me, once the wrinkles have been ironed out its smooth sailing.... till the next os update LOL i'm just kidding.

[devilock76]

<snark>Real programmers use vi</snark>

Ken

[devilock76]

I have not heard anything good about programming python on a mac. If I may make a recommendation, install Virtual Box and if you want to program in python I would recommend installing in a virtual machine something like FreeBSD or a Linux. There are just more python resources in those worlds from my experience.

I "know" python as in I have studied on it and coded in it, but hobbyist only as it is not in my day to day routine so many questions will force me to the manual.

Ken

[sgreger1]

As a newbie i would go with 3.0 2.6 is basically dead (not supported any more) 2.7 will be supported for a long time yet. There is alot of 3.0 stuff around the block and fro free. http://learnpythonthehardway.org/index is awesome he has a book addressing 2.7 and 3.0 and its fee he also has a link to a byte of python website. Again its a free book/tutorial covering 2.7 or 3.0. Both site have many followers that can help you if you are stuck also the authors will even help you out.

Once basic knowledge is obtained of the language you won't be needing any or many books/tutorials helpto you out on your way (addressing just python alone, then you can start dabbling into database's, web frameworks SDK's CDK's ect)

I'm not a mac user so i can't help on that side of things.

Yah I read the byte of python one which is what i am reading right now. Really good tutorials. I jus twant to know the basics of programming so I can better understand the structure of languages etc, once I have that I will be able to learn python quickly, but I want to get a firm understanding of the basics so that is mainly what I am reading on.


I just can't figure out why I can't get the code to run in the interpreter, I can't try anything until I find this out.

[sgreger1]

Did you install the 64 bit version of IDLE? there seems to be issues with Mac OSX 10.6

Take a look

http://www.python.org/download/mac/tcltk/

I initially installed the 64 bit version untill I saw the warning on the IDLE page, so I sw9itched to 32 bit instead, still no luck.

[sgreger1]

captncaveman touched on it earlier. I believe it has to do with the quotes in the text you copied. The quotes that show in the code you pasted are slanted, e.g.:

# Area calculation program
 
print “Welcome to the Area calculation program”
print “–––––––––––––”

when they should be plain quotes

# Area calculation program
 
print "Welcome to the Area calculation program"
print "–––––––––––––"

Wow, is that really the problem? I knew it was some stupid syntax problem but since this was literally my first experience with Python I am not so great at figuring out what I typed wrong.

So how do I make them less slanted, do I have to use a different font when writing in the text file?

[sgreger1]

I have not heard anything good about programming python on a mac. If I may make a recommendation, install Virtual Box and if you want to program in python I would recommend installing in a virtual machine something like FreeBSD or a Linux. There are just more python resources in those worlds from my experience.

I "know" python as in I have studied on it and coded in it, but hobbyist only as it is not in my day to day routine so many questions will force me to the manual.

Ken

This is sort of what I am running up against here, it seems like once again Mac is the wrong way to go for now, the problem is that it is all I own because my PC (of course) broke. I am saving to get an actual Windows 7 desktop but for the near future I will only have my macbook pro.

What I don't get is that it COMES with a python interpreter that is already loaded with the computer out of the box. For some reason I can't get it to listen to what I have to say though, maybe it was those quotes.

I just odn't see why doing something simple like writting little 20 line programs would be something a Mac could not handle, in fact I refuse to believe that, but I do know that there are ALWAYS more resources for PC which is why I am saving to get one for this purpose alone.


A GENERAL QUESTION TO ALL: How long did it take you before you learned your first programming language enough to where you could start tinkering with it and move away from tutorials? It shouldn't take too long, right? I am hoping to learn a pretty decent amount of Python by the end of the year, I want to at least be able to do somethign with it at that point, I understand that doing complex programming takes years of experience but if I could even do simple stuff by the end of the year I would be happy.

[devilock76]

This is sort of what I am running up against here, it seems like once again Mac is the wrong way to go for now, the problem is that it is all I own because my PC (of course) broke. I am saving to get an actual Windows 7 desktop but for the near future I will only have my macbook pro.

What I don't get is that it COMES with a python interpreter that is already loaded with the computer out of the box. For some reason I can't get it to listen to what I have to say though, maybe it was those quotes.

I just odn't see why doing something simple like writting little 20 line programs would be something a Mac could not handle, in fact I refuse to believe that, but I do know that there are ALWAYS more resources for PC which is why I am saving to get one for this purpose alone.


A GENERAL QUESTION TO ALL: How long did it take you before you learned your first programming language enough to where you could start tinkering with it and move away from tutorials? It shouldn't take too long, right? I am hoping to learn a pretty decent amount of Python by the end of the year, I want to at least be able to do somethign with it at that point, I understand that doing complex programming takes years of experience but if I could even do simple stuff by the end of the year I would be happy.

That is why I said virtualize a linux or freebsd box on the mac through virtual box (or similar VM hosting program) and work in there. Heck in a way it creates a "jailed" environment so that if you have a program you made run amok you can easily kill it without bringing down your computer itself. "Jails" are a freebsd thing but deep down a mac is kind of BSD based. I just quoted it just because. Anyway, virtual environments can be an ideal place to develop and work on alpha and early levels of code.

I am not saying that mac can't handle it, I am just saying that from what I have seen there are more tools to your disposal in non Mac *nix environs. Then again you can get those to work on a mac to. I don't own a mac so I just don't know, although I plan to buy a mac in the coming months.

As for the time it takes to learn a language. For me it has nothing to do with time but how deep and how often I need to dig into the language. That is really all there is to it. Think of learning to program as a hole filled with dirt. You got to get your dirt out of the hole to know it all. How big a shovel you use and how fast you shovel are the variables in the time to goal equation.

Ken